How to listen in mono in lmms?

[D.Ipsum]

Really, if I'm wrong, please, give me an explanation.

Only thing i have left is, that if the Narrower worked, there should not be any change of output, if any instrument is changed in panning.
That is not the case.

OK, but what about the Audacity's conversion from stereo to "true" mono?
I guess we can not say that it does not work.

The test I did (read one of my previous comments) seems valid to me:

I compared a file having a narrower with the same file without narrower but which was converted to "true" mono with Audacity. In other words, I compared a file in "false" mono with the same file in "true" mono. To be able to compare them, I reversed the phase of one of the two files. And the phase opposition between the two files was perfect because when I mix the two files, their phase was canceled, I got a silent track.

In other words, the narrower with strength = 1 seems to perform the same transformation as the Audacity's conversion from stereo to true mono.

I understand this as a demonstration that the narrower with stregnth = 1 transforms a stereo content (the L channel is different from the R channel) into a mono content (the L channel is the same as the R channel). And therefore, the narrower can be used to check mono compatibility.

It seems then that when you say "if the Narrower worked, there should not be any change of output, if any instrument is changed in panning", it's not correct (because Audacity seems to be doing the same thing as the narrower).

If there is, where is the misunderstanding between us?

It seems like I'm passionate

[D.Ipsum]

Well, I'm not an expert, but I think I understand this:

Illustration of the interest of verifying mono compatibility by an extreme case.

Open the TripleOscillator and, in the Plugin tab, modify the values ​​of the following parameters:

- OSC 2 > CRS = 0
- OSC 2 > PO = 180
- OSC 3 > VOL = 0

Now, if you play a few notes, you will not hear anything, the phases are canceled (cf. the test that I previously described).

It's as if you had given the following instruction:

- Oscillator 1 will vibrate your speakers' membrane in one direction (e.g. starting from the front to the back).
- Oscillator 2 will vibrate your speakers' membrane in the opposite direction (e.g. starting from the back to the front).
- Result, the membrane does not vibrate, it can not simultaneously be in front and back.

Note that we are in the context of mono content (the content of the L channel is identical to the content of the R channel).


Let's move on to stereo content (the content of the L channel is different from the content of the R channel).

With the same TripleOscillator, in the Plugin tab, add the following changes:

- OSC 1 > PAN = -100
- OSC 2 > PAN = +100

Now, if you play a few notes, you'll hear something again. But what you hear could be quite unpleasant:

- Oscillator 1 will vibrate the diaphragm of your left speaker in one direction (e.g. starting from the front to the back).
- Oscillator 2 will vibrate the membrane of your right speaker in the other direction (e.g., starting from the back to the front).
- The point is : you ear something!


And what will happen if we check the mono compatibility?

With the same TripleOscillator, in the FX tab, add the C*Narrower with strength = 1.

What is going on? If you play some notes, you will not hear anything, again. You will not hear anything because the narrower converts the stereo content (L is different from R) into mono (L is identical to R), and the sum of contradictory instructions = 0 or silence. This is an extreme case.

The point is, although we heard something in the previous step (stereo content), it was not mono compatible!
(and we do not care about the distinction between "true" and "false" mono when it comes to check mono compatibility.This distinction is useful only if you want to save space on your hard drive)



In practice, when you check the mono compatibility of an entire project, it is extremely improbable that you find this case (here we have only a sine wave, i.e. just a fundamental frequency without harmonics, and nothing more complex), but if it happens, it is only necessary to reverse the phase of one of the two channels to get a perfect mono compatibility).

In practice, when you convert a stereo content (L is different from R) into mono content (L = R), what certainly happens is more or less significant changes in amplitude (dB) in certain frequency bands or timbral alterations. The idea is that the alteration of your project does not bother you, that it is not very perceptible. And if the alteration bothers you, make corrections to your project.

[D.Ipsum]

me too:))) guys i love the discussion... its such a big knowledge

Not "such"

Just "it is a big knowledge"

A big knowledge that encloses the secret of the universe

That of keeping us busy

[D.Ipsum]

Rewording + some "important" corrections :

- stereo file = file consisting of two tracks.
- mono file = file consisting of a single track.

- the two tracks of a stereo file can be:
- totally different (= stereo component)
- partially different
- or identical (= mono component, "false" mono)

- from the moment when the two tracks of a stereo file are different, you may be worried about mono compatibility.


The fun part : import in Audacity (2.1.2) a song that you like and:

To convert a stereo file to a mono file:

- Tracks > Stereo to mono tracks


To convert a stereo file to a fake mono file:

- Tracks > Stereo to mono tracks
- Tracks > Add new … > Stereo track
- Copy and Paste the mono track into the track that is empty (and delete the mono track)


To isolate the stereo component (what differs between the L and R channels) and the mono component ( what is the same between the L and R channels):

- Select your audio track
- Click on his name > Name > "Original"
- Edit > Duplicate

- Select the copy of "Original"
- Tracks > Stereo to mono tracks
- Click on his name > Name > "Mono component"

- Tracks > Add new … > Stereo track
- Copy and Paste the "Mono component" into the empty track
- Click on its name > Name > "False Mono"

- Select "Original"
- Edit > Duplicate

- Select the copy of "Original"
- Effects > Invert

- Select the inverted copy of "Original" and the "False Mono "
- Tracks > Mixing and Rendering
- Click on its name > Name > "Stereo component"

So, now you have three tracks : "Original" (in stereo), "Mono component" (in mono) and "Stereo component" (in stereo).

At this stage, I have the impression that "Original" = "Mono component" + "Stereo component".

But, the image of "Stereo component" is inverted, it's like looking in a mirror : what is on the left is on the right.

- So, click on the name of "Stereo component" > Permute the stereo channels.

Now, "Original" = "Mono component" + "Stereo component".

Listen carefully to each of these tracks! I have the impression that is "Stereo component" what can be problematic when you convert your projects in mono.

- Select "Mono component" andd "Stereo component"
- Tracks > Mixing and Rendering.
- Select this rendered track
- Effects > Invert
- Select "Original" and the inverted mixed track
- Tracks > Mixing and Rendering.

- Now you get a silent track ...

It's a sleight of hand

Have you tried?
What do you think?

[D.Ipsum]

At this moment, I'm listening to the tracks of Richard David James in this way, the stereo part, the side part. It's instructive. In fact, this guy seems very centered. On some tracks, there are few edge effects, few side effects, a reduced stereo. Part of his magic is played there, like the cherry on the cake. He put the cherry on the (mono) cake. I'm begining to understand that too many cherries on the cake give you a cherry cake. RDJ does not make cherry cake. He puts the cherry on the cake. It's different and it's delicious.

It reminds me of the time when I used to drink coffee sugar. You understand that I've learn quickly enough to drink sugar coffee. Now I prefer to drink Milo, with even less sugar. It's a small victory. But as I've drunk all my stock of Milo, unfortunately, I'm drinking back to coffee. That's why I'm not sleeping, and that's why I'm writing to you all that goes through my mind. Small defeat. It's crazy when I think about it, I prefer to make music by drinking coffee or Milo rather than alcohol. Alcohol puts me to sleep. That's why I do not drink alcohol. However, although I play music while drinking Milo, or coffee when I'm out of Milo, that's not what I prefer. I prefer to forget myself in the smoke of god. What the fuck? Yes. That's other thing. It's just different. It's like a door that opens to the mystic. Small revelation. But when I think about it, it's not even a question of preference. When I smoke, I have to make music, it's irrepressible. It's not about craving, but about the effect, it's like that, irrepressible. But the truth, it's I have not smoked for a few years now. Do you understand that? This little lack? Well, the day comes up, I finish drinking my coffee, the seeds have sprouted, and the summer is comming. A small smile.

...