The struggle of Gps learning music and sheetmusic

Anything that doesn't fit into other topics goes here!
401 posts
I am sharing this, because I think it will make some people smile ( and or laugh)

Although I am not sure, if I want to cover this, I was messing around with A forest - The cure.
For those who do not know this song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xik-y0xlpZ0

Dang dang etc.

I need practice, mostly about how long a note lasts. When I hear some piece of music, I don't have a clue on how long that note will be in lmms.

I used google to find a piece of sheet music, and found it. I also used google and that bpm tool, to find the right bpm.
158 :o

The part about sheet music I do get 100%, are the notes used.
So I found it should be A and A ( one octave higher)

That piece of sheet music also had something totally confusing me.
The first note played started before a bar. wtf ? What happened to the other note (notes)
As in 1,2,3,4 or in this case at the start of the song, 2 notes in 4 counts.

I had already tried to get the right note length, with out the piece of sheet music by just changing the notes in lmms and only using the mouse to put in the notes. I was getting closer, so I was making progress.

Then I said to myself, screw this sheet music, and plugged in my midi controller.

I had already a simple beat and bassline, so I hit the second record option in the piano roll.
( this option records but will also play the beat and bass-line )

I did my best, and wtf were did that first note I hit, go ? Why did lmms ignore this first note? Is my timing that bad ?

The easiest solution was off course to put this piece in the song editor one square to the left, so it would record my notes, no matter how bad my timing might be.

So I tried again, and guess what happened ? The first note I played started before the bar. LOL.

Owwww, that's what that piece of sheet music was trying to tell me.

After this I am very happy of course. It proofs two things. I can't read sheet music yet, but I do have some talent, if only about the rhythm of a song. :D
Obviously your ear is pretty good. Now you just need to believe what you read on the sheet music. But I still think you're doing better than me because I have a terrible ear for music so I have to rely on theory and sheet music :(.

And just to wind you up a bit more....that note or notes hanging around before the start of the first bar is known in music speak as an "anacrusis" and at least in conventional music you should also find a bar at the end of the piece with less than the normal number of beats in to balance it out ;).

Steve
The cure ! You chose some really hard artists and songs
Gps wrote: and that bpm tool, to find the right bpm.
158 :o
No that is wrong you count the hits of the kick over a minute. The cures music is anything but fast, its even slower that hiphop
158 bpm would be serious hardstyle or acid (though a little slow for acid)

Try again it is not 158 -my count is in the bottom of this..

























I count 81, so its propl 80
slipstick wrote:Obviously your ear is pretty good. Now you just need to believe what you read on the sheet music. But I still think you're doing better than me because I have a terrible ear for music so I have to rely on theory and sheet music :(.

And just to wind you up a bit more....that note or notes hanging around before the start of the first bar is known in music speak as an "anacrusis" and at least in conventional music you should also find a bar at the end of the piece with less than the normal number of beats in to balance it out ;).

Steve
Thank you, now it makes sense, learned something again. And my ears are not as good as I wish, this has more to do with timing.
But I can tap along with a song, on and of the beat without breaking sweat.
musikbear wrote:The cure ! You chose some really hard artists and songs
Gps wrote: and that bpm tool, to find the right bpm.
158 :o
No that is wrong you count the hits of the kick over a minute. The cures music is anything but fast, its even slower that hiphop
158 bpm would be serious hardstyle or acid (though a little slow for acid)

Try again it is not 158 -my count is in the bottom of this..

count 81, so its propl 80
You are probably right, but.....
When I tried that bpm tool, I found about the same number as you, but I was using that tool, because I had found more then one site, claiming it was that high, and I said that cant be right.
So I used that tool and found 78. I then assumed I had to do 78 times two.

I hope not to confuse anybody, but I still think musicbear is right.
This piece has a not easy to hear quite fast tjk tjk tjk tjk.
My piece has now in the beat and bassline, tjk nothing tjk nothing tjk nothing and so on.

If I fill every square, and make the bpm around what musicbears says, I should be at the right speed.

( I always import the mp3 I have, converted to ogg, into lmms. Just to hear if I am doing it right. Although you will never have your song and the mp3 really synct ( feature request ? :P ) you should be able to get it close enough.
You will have to change the silence at the start of the song with a program like audacity. this has to do with a little bit of time it takes lmms to start a song. I do not know that value from the top of my head, but in my topic, popcorn trouble, musicbear tells me that value)

But:
https://www.cs.ubc.ca/~davet/music/trac ... H4-02.html

Mixmeister BPM: 155.0
Traktor BPM: 155.0 (100.0%)
Mixmeister Key: A m
I have been cheating. ;) But learned a lot again.

The Cure - A forest.
A piece of sheet music claimed it was A,A - A,A - A,A -A,A
That did not sound right to my ears, compared to the original, but what was wrong?
I lack the experience to really hear what the cure is doing, I can however hear, mine is not the same.

When I looked at a midi file I found the problem.

Mine a forest, is in timing pretty good, but I knew I had to look for a different piece of sheet music, after this.

The start is A and then another A one octave higher. Then this part is played another three times, but the highest note of the two goes down. So that is, what I am hearing.

For others learning music, try to find midi songs, and learn from it.
It really helps me to understand sheet music, and how some parts I hear, are played in lmms.

Or in other words, how does a piece of sheet music look like in lmms.

It's frustrating but I will get there. Part of my problem is, when I look at a piece of sheet music, I don't have a clue if it is even anything close, to what it should be.

It also helped me, looking at a you tube vid of a guitar player, showing how to play it.
I don't fully understand guitars, but enough to see it could not be 4 times A,A
You may already know this but if you find a midi file that sounds good to you you can always load it into Anvil Studio or MuseScore (both free) and they will show it as "sheet music" i.e. notes on staves. If you want to print a copy of it MuseScore is the one to go for.

That way you have sheet music that definitely matches what you're listening to which can only help with learning to read sheet music.

Steve
That has been suggested before, and I should use it, to get a better understanding of sheet music.

I am a bit jealous of those who just look at sheet music, and then already have an idea how it sounds.

What I am gonna try to do, is only get the a b c d part from the sheet music, and then use my midi controller to play it.
That solves one of my biggest issues with sheet music. How long is a 1/4 note on the sheetmusic in lmms.
This will of course only work for music I already know.
Working again on Biscaya. Thank god It seems I am to stubborn to quit.

Slowly I start to better understand sheet music, and because of this I came to a simple conclusion.

The piece of sheet music I have matches the midi file I have, but they don't match the mp3, which I imported into lmms.
The sheet music s good enough to help me, but 51 seconds into the song, there is an D, which also is in the midi file, but comparing it to the mp3, there is a note too much.

Further more I totally don't like that extra D, so out it goes. Another hour wasted ? or another lesson learned ?

Its funny the midi file sounds better for now then my version, but I still refuse to just copy paste it.

This biscaya cover is for me literately two steps forward, then one step back, and so on.

Learning a lot. I just selected all notes from the beginning and made them all a tiny bit longer, so now they overlap a bit.
That did wonders to that part of the song. Instead of beep beep beep, its now more of a flow of notes.

Looking back, I probably should not have taken this piece to cover, at least not at this time. I was / am in over my head.

To share my struggle with you guys: https://soundcloud.com/user586365033/biscaya

To my surprise it already has two likes. I don't like it myself yet, because its still off in timing, as most here, will probably notice.

Another thing learned, positive reactions on soundcloud don't mean that much. :P

Edit:
If I wont give up though, I might come to the point were I recognize notes from an mp3.
( if its an a or ..)
Also frustrating, the better my ears get, the more errors I hear, and the more picky I get
Sheet music is a pain! I'm learning to play classical on my keyboard so I know the struggle.

When the first bar of music doesn't have the same notes as per the timing (ex. 4/4 timing the first bar only has three beats with no rest) so where did the other note go? The fourth beat magically appears at the end usually in a bar by itself. I've run across this more times than I can count.

I don't play by ear on my keyboard but I do play by ear on my bass guitar. I can tell you this the more you do that and the more you listen to the song with our without the help of sheet music either original or midi you will get better at it. There are apps that help with ear training but since I don't use them I can't comment on how useful they are. Some people on this piano board I belong to use them frequently others not so much or not at all. It's ultimately up to you if you want to use those tools or not.
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